[ last update: 11.07.2014 ]
The (new)
Cadillac Database©
The Cadillac V16
Series 452-452A
1930-1931
Part 1l
Production
Statistics
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This table was converted from the Excel file in which, since the early eighties, I had concentrated raw data about V16 production and surviving cars. If any users have more current information on any of the cars listed here, or information about other V16s not mentioned here, I will gladly incorporate it in this section of The (New) Cadillac Database©.
I believe the table is self-explanatory; however, if anyone has difficulty "reading" it, I will be glad to give further explanations.
Now a brief word in respect of production cut-off dates for the Cadillac "Sixteens". As mentioned in a footnote
Mr. Steig considers that V16 chassis up to #702600 were built on 1930 and higher numbers in 1931; Alan Merkel - an equally knowledgeable V16 historian - indicates that the last chassis for 1930 carries #702887. Alan provides the following facts in support of his position that the 1930-31 split for Model 452 V-16s occurred at the end of December, 1930, with the final 1930 shipment being engine number 702887:
It is my understanding from correspondence with Mr. Roy Schneider that Mr. Steig chose #702600 as the cutoff for 1930 V-16 production based upon the fact that 1931 V-8 and V-12 production began in the fall of 1930. I believe that Mr. Steig's choice for the cutoff at that point was reasonable and good judgment based upon the best evidence available at the time, but that additional information now available supports a different conclusion based upon the following:
- Based upon the factory shipping ledger, #702600 was shipped on August 16, 1930, whereas 1931 V-8 shipments began on September 13, 1930 and V-12 shipments began on October 15, 1930. Shipments of 1930 V-8 cars began in September of 1929 so they were produced for approximately one year. Nearly 200 additional V-16s had been shipped in 1930 between his August 16 arbitrary cutoff and the date V-12 shipments began.
- The "model year" concept did not begin until 1936. 1931 V-16s were shipped until the end of 1931 and into February of 1932. Using the August, 1930 cutoff for 1930 V-16s, one would have to believe that 1930 V-16s were produced for 8 1/2 months, 1931s were produced for 18 1/2 months, and then V-16s were produced for 12 months in each of the years from 1932 through 1935. This is unlikely.
- The factory shipping ledger shows that #702887 was the highest engine number shipped in 1930. Two cars with lower engine numbers (702840 and 702883) were not shipped until 1931, but their production would have been in sequential order in 1930.
- The factory shipping log contains a "1931" entry beside #702888 indicating the start of 1931 shipments at that point (I have attached a photo of that entry in the Factory shipping ledger).
- Additional data published at the time we are discussing (1930s) supports the cutoff of 1930 V-16 production at 702887. The BRANHAM AUTOMOBILE REFERENCE BOOK published by the Ben P. Branham Company of Chicago provided detailed data on all passenger cars and trucks showing serial number locations and listings by model year, along with other detailed information useful to insurance companies and agents, state authorities, dealers, law enforcement, and many others in need of accurate data. In the forward to each issue the Publisher acknowledges indebtedness to the auto manufacturers who cooperated by supplying Branham with the information and checking the proofs of the printed matter to ensure reliability of the reference. I have attached photos of the pages from the REFERENCE pertaining to the 1930 and 1931 V-16s showing that 1930 production included engines from 700001 to 702887, and that 1931 production of V-16s included engines starting with 702888 (the last being 703251).
Based upon the above, I hope you will agree that it is not necessary for us to use conjecture as a means of determining the cutoff for 1930 V-16s. Published documents from the period include the information, as supplied by the manufacturer, and provide the answer. I am forwarding the above information to you in hopes that you will reflect it in a future revision to your web site where you refer to 1930 and 1931 V-16s.
Best Regards, Alan Merkel
Thank you Carl and Alan for sharing with users of the Cadillac Database your in-depth research into the production of the Cadillac Series 452 and 452A V-16 models. Thank you also Rick Le Forge for donating to the Database all your penciled "fingerprints" of these same V16s that you encountered in your travels around the country; they have helped me enormously to create and maintain the table, below.
A word
of caution: factory build sheets are filed by engine # (NOT chassis #)
there may be occasionally confusion in this listing between engine and chassis numbers
Production Month | Total Cars Shipped | Cumulative Total |
Engine Nos. From To |
Notes on specific cars [ by engine number, where known ] | |
Dec.29 | 3 | 3 | 1 | 3 | #1 [shipped 12.28.1929; #2 = 4264B [body #1 ???] |
Jan.30 | 5 | 8 | 4 | 8 | #4 = 4108C [ex-4155C ???, body #3]; [unknown #] = 4380 |
Feb.30 | 367 | 375 | 9 | 375 | #12 = style 4375S [to NY]; #21 = engine only, with radiator & shell; #22 = 4375S, body #50; #23 = 4302?, body #3?; #38 = 4375S, body #45 [Don Lee showroom V16, later chopped to truck, then maybe 4302]; #72 = [believed] 4330S then body replaced with Style #3982, body #7, from a V-8 car; #96=4330S, body#17, advertised in Self-Starter classifieds, Nov.-Dec. 2014; #100 = 4130S [for L.P. Fisher]; #101 = 4355S [went to Denver, CO]; #115 = 4355, body #4 [Rik LeForge former "Ole Yeller", now J.B. Nethercutt]; #130 = 4302, body #3 [special show car]; #132 = 4375 [installed later in a 1933 custom Chrysler Imperial by Lou Fageol]; #149 = 4380, body #1; #150 = 4380, body #1 [destroyed and re-bodied with style 3882]; #156 = 4302 body 29; #163 = 4330 [Robert Taunton]; #169 = 4375-S, body #76 [currently,1998, is a bare chassis - was initially for sale in Bedford, VA, 10/1959 for $125!]; #194 [believed to be now a repro 4302 - per Rik LeForge; #266 = possibly a bare chassis w/ 4260 style hood for the Maharajah of Orchha - shipped 17.7.1931 to Bombay; #283 = now a spare engine (offered for sale on eBay, 12/2003; #298 = 3991 [V8 body on V16 chassis, possibly Ernestine Schumann-Heink car - has survived]; #321 = 4375S, body #333; #333 = maybe 4302, in France; #353 = 4302 (?) {offered at auction in Geneva, Switzerland, in the nineties); #335 = 4235 for C.T. Fisher |
Mar.30 | 436 | 811 | 376 | 811 | #416 = [currently] 4302 [but is a replacement motor]; #425 = demo engine; #466 = demo engine [Gilmore Museum]; #476 = 4330, body #99; #482 = 4330, body #95 [converted to 4302, body #32]; #492 = 4325; #494 = 4380, body #19 - Hopalong Cassidy car, studio photos exist]; #499 = 4375, converted body 3880 to 4380 ; #519 = 4375S [rusted hulk]; #543 = 4380, body #34 [built Fleetwood, PA - early '30 details]; #556 = 4260 [W.A. Fisher]; #655 = 4380 [survivor]; #666 = ??? [currently in a boat hauler!]; #665 = 4260; #666 = 4361S [seen by Rick LeForge in Oregon]; #697 = 4302 [Marc Ohm restoration]; #716 = unk. [currently (2004) a Fisher-bodied AWP]; #731=custom ambulance (rebody?); #733 = 4330S [body #137 - it was exported]; #759 = 4361S, body #52, ex-Harrah collection]; #789 = 4375, body #157; #807 = engine tested by Lycoming Motors, 06.27.1930; #809 = 4302 [survivor] |
Apr.30 | 576 | 1387 | 812 | 1387 | #817 = 4380 [survivor?]; #821 = 4108C [began as another body style ???]; #847 = 4302, body #23 [ex-Harrah, exc. restored but some wrong details]; #850 = 4330S, body#188 [offered for sale on Ebay, July 2014]; #851 = 4108C; #859 = 4375 [survivor]; #883 = 4380 or 4280 (?) - body destroyed; #898 = 4335 [survivor]; #906 = cv. cpe [4235 or 4335?] parted out; #916 = 4361S [survivor]; #917 = was a sedan, now a 4302 [in Germany, 2001-2007]; #964 = 43021, body #28; #965 = 4302 [ex Otis Chandler]; #966 = 4302, body #30; #979 = 4330S body #185 [one of six V-16 cars used for a promotional tour in Europe, in June 1930, was built on chassis VIN 701554; later, that chassis got custom coachwork by Paris' Jacques Saoutchik - I have build sheet3]; #991 = [special phaeton, Murphy]; #1001 = 4375S shipped to Philadelphia, PA; #1010 = 4375 [shipped to Newark, NJ; #1011 = 4335S [shipped to Toledo, OH]; #1012 = 4375 [shipped to New York]; #1013 = 4330S [shipped to Chicago, IL]; #1014 = 4375S [possibly w/ leather roof, shipped to San Francisco, CA]; #1015-1018 = all 4375S [shipped respectively to Wilmington, DE, New York, Fort Wayne, IN and Philadelphia, PA]; #1019 = 4161S [shipped to Los Angeles, CA]; #1021 = 4330S [shipped to San Francisco, CA]; #1025 = 4376 body 20 [got body tag imprint]; #1031 = 4302, body #37 [shipped to Philadelphia, PA - currently (5/2000) in France]; #1041 = 4361S [shipped to Portland, ME]; #1051 = 4361S [shipped to Newark, NJ]; 1056 = 4302, body #29 [Dr. Joseph A. Murphy collection, 10/2000]; #1061 = 4375S [shipped to Oklahoma City]; #1069 = 4361???; #1070 = 4361 or 4361S [destroyed] [currently in 4302 body 73]; #1071 = 4375S [shipped to Providence, RI]; #1078 = 4207 [body #16669 - other two were #16679 and 16681; #1081 = 4335 [shipped to San Francisco, CA]; #1091 = 4361S [shipped to Portland, OR]; #1096 = 4330 [exported to New Zealand in 1933]; #1101 = 4355 [shipped to New York]; #1112 = 4130S or 4330S [now engine only]; #1144 = 4330S? [now engine only]; #1146 = 4361S, body #134 [formerly Wayne Merriman coll..]; #1154=4375S [to Don Lee; now in Holland]; #1160 = 4130S [for L.P. Fisher]; #1146 = 4361S body 134 [now 4275S body 333 - very bad rust]; #1173 = 4161S or 4361S??? [now engine parts only]; #1175 = 4175S for A.J. Fisher]; #1201 = 4330S [shipped to Oklahoma City]; #1208=4361S, #1225 = 4302, body #46; #1259 = 4376, body #43 [was parted out]; #1266 = [currently 4380]; #1288 = 43352; #1289 = [unk., but was possibly mounted later in a 1933 Chrysler Imperial; chassis]; #1295 = 4376, body #43; #1301 = 4330 [shipped to Brooklyn, NY]; #1304 = o/s engine now; #1321 = 4375S, Body #333; #1323 = 4380, body #84 [now 4302 body #26 - wrong wheels other wrong details]; #1325 = 4380 [for E.F. Fisher]; #1334 = 4361S ??? [only chassis remains]; #1341 = 30-158 [Fisher coupe, Dick Shappy]; #1371 = 4380, body #69; #1378 = [currently] bare chassis & motor, in Australia. |
May.30 | 442 | 1829 | 1388 | 1829 | #1401 = 4330S [shipped to Brooklyn. NY]; #1432 = 4302, body #26 [Briggs Cunningham Museum]; #1467 = 4330S, body #27; #1495 = 4380, body #98 [orig. body destroyed, now 4302, body #20]; #1501 = 4380 [shipped to Washington, DC]; #1502 = 4375S [survivor]; #1519 = 4375S (hearsay) [engine only - could be also #1919]; #1530 = 4220 town car [shipped to Buenos Aires, Argentina], motor currently in Spain, in a racing car; #1540 = 4376, body #53; #1550 = 4175S [for C.T. Fisher]; the next five VINs are in sequential order; these are the five V-16s that were taken off the line specifically to be shipped to Copenhagen for the promotional tour of Europe from June to September, 1930: #1551 = 4264B (left factory June 10) ; #1552 = 4330S (left June 6); #1553 = 4175 (left June 10); #1554 = 4260 (left June 11) [this was body #2; it was later removed and replaced with convertible sedan body by Saoutchik (I have the build sheet3) - Steven Nanini, CLC Senior car #141]; #1555 = 4235 (left June 11); #1561=4380 [first sold in NY, later went to France circa 1990]: #1608 = 4330S, body #320; #1609 = 4175, body #24]; #1617=4375 [ex-Capone armored limousine]; #1658 = 4330S, body #95 [converted to 4302 ??? - in France]; #1659 = 4175, body #24 [J.C. Leake, "V" windshield "Madame X"]; #1673 = 4375S, body #399; #1697 = 4380 [???]; #1701 = 4375S [shipped to Oklahoma City]; #1725 [blank record - possibly "demo" engine on show at Olympia, London, Oct. 1930]; #1733 = 4276 or 4376 ??? [body junked, now engine only]; #1755 = 4130S [for C.T. Fisher]; #1758 = 4355 (#32); #1769 = 4175 (or 4175S) [sold at Scottsdale, 24.1.1986 for $64000; #1772=4376, body #74, [offered for sale, Dec. 2011]; #1801 = 4376 [shipped to Los Angeles]; #1810 = 4381, body #19; |
Jun.30 | 384 | 2213 | 1830 | 2213 | #1834 = 4380 AWP [Dick Shappy]; #1849 = 4257A or 4257H [Joe Moore]; #1866 [powers a hot rod built in the 40s (added 2010)]; #1877 = 4302, body #58; #1878(?) may be a 4260 phaeton or 4380 AWP, located in Peru (1999); #1881 = 4281, body #19; #1901 = 30-168 Fisher conv. coupe [factory service car]; #1954 = 4302, body #73 [later replaced with body from #1070?]; #2025 = 4335 [restored 2001]; #2029-4225 [Cecil B. DeMille]; #2042 = 4130S [destroyed by fire; now carries Fleetwood V8 town car style #3912; located in Japan]; #2050 = 4175 [now engine only]; #2054 = 4155S, body #2 [formerly Wayne Merriman coll.]; #2055 = 4155S [ body #2 ????]; #2056 = 4130 [ex-Serge Pozzoli, France, chassis 2024(?)]; #2073 = Nordberg town car; #2070 = 4302, body #77 [has disc wheels]; #2089 = 4335; #2101 = 4130S [shipped to Bloomfield N.J.] (???); #2103 = 4130S [for sale on eBay, 10/2005]; #2104 = 4261S? [body destroyed; now engine only, put in repro 4302?]; #2117 = Fisher custom LX2913 shipped 21 June to CT]; #2137 = 4302 ???; #2152 = 4276, body #14) |
Jul.30 | 297 | 2510 | 2214 | 2510 | #2225 = o/s engine now; #2232 = 4175S, body #42; #2236 = 4130S [for F.J. Fisher]; #2246 = 4276, body #17 [engine number changed?]; #2261 = 4276 [body destroyed; now engine only]; #2270 = possibly custom job for W.A. Fisher]; #2280 = 4175, body #90 [RHD - to Antwerp?]; #2291 = 4276 [new, 10/2004]; #2297 = Van den Plas landaulet [RHD, body No. 556 - shipped to London; later Lyon Classic Cars, L.A.]; #2298=Van den Plas [apparently built originally for the VERY wealthy Nabab (ruler) of Bahawalpur, currently (2011-12) in Pakistan]; #2338 = 4302 ???; #2363 = 4235 [in Sweden, 10/2000]; #2381 = 4235 [a survivor]; #2388 = Fisher custom LX2905; #2401 = 4260 [auctioned 2/06]; #2402 = 4375, first owned by President of Mexico, then by a Mr. Weaver, then John O'Sullivan (who restored it), then Ed Meurer ; #2408 = 4260, body #34; #2414 = 4275, body #47 [shipped to London]; #2415 = 4330S, #2425 = 4260 [late Dick Gold, body #33 - now Fred Weber? - not 100% sure!]; 2455 = coupe style; #2478 = 4260, body #55 for Richard Arlen, Hollywood star [Edward Dauer, CLC Senior car #142]; #2486 = 4276, body #54 [registered in 1931]; #2488 = 4375, body #319 [Ben LeForge]; #2494 = 4380[?] |
Aug.30 | 166 | 2676 | 2511 | 2676 | #2514 = 4260 [Fred Weber - rebody??? - Fred also has/had Dick Gold's "4260", below]; #2515 = 4260 [Otis Chandler]; #2573 = 4235, body #45; #2584 = 4155C [Body #18, currently in Zurich; worked for many years as firehouse ladder vehicle near Zürich, Switzerland; was for sale in Germany, 2/2014]; this range includes also style #4200, built in Aug. 1930); #2643 = 4375 [was destroyed in a fatal accident in Sweden]; #2588 = 4260, body #41; #2594 = 4276, body #71; #2619 = 4235 ??? [owned by Bud Tinney, Fla.]; #2631 = 4375 [body junked - now engine only - former White House ???]; #2636 = 4380 [Elliott Klein]; #2643=4380; #2655 = 4235 [Brent Merrill] |
Sep.30 | 82 | 2758 | 2677 | 2758 | #2677 = 4260, body #25 [factory says shipped 30 Aug. to Don Lee - did Don lee fit the second cowl & windshield?]; #2648 (body #357) = 4330S [added 7/2000]; #2682 = 4260, body #8 [like #2677, this car is reported to have been fitted with a dual cowl and secondary windshield]; #2691 = 4260, body #7 [like #2677 and #2682, this car too is reported to have been fitted with a dual cowl and secondary windshield]; #2734 = 4260 shipped to Berlin]; #2746 = 4175 [RHD] "Madame X" [body #70, originally shipped to Madrid, then Governor of Gibraltar]; could be chassis #2877 owned by German collector Dirk Mueller [car reported as having been delivered first to Governor of Gibraltar]; #2747 = 4380 [RHD] , shipped to Port Elisabeth, South Africa]; #2751 = 4260 [survivor] |
Oct.30 | 54 | 2812 | 2759 | 2812 | #2762 = 4375 [shipped to New York and later diverted and exported]; #2769 = 4175 [exported to London]; #2783 = 4375 ???; #2785 = 4330S; #2797 (or #2998?) = 4260 [unsure]; #2800 = bare chassis [exported to Paris - possibly Kellner town car or Saoutchik 5-pass. convertible Victoria]; #2802 = bare chassis [exported to Stockholm]; #2807 = 4235, body #91; #2809 = 4175MmeX; |
Nov.30 | 33 | 2845 | 2813 | 2845 | #2814 = 4391, body #18; #2818 currently [10/2001] in Havana, Cuba [history and body style unknown (possibly 4175 or 4375)]; #2834 = 4235, body #92 [many special features; car was stolen 7/1976]; #2873 = ???? export ???? (Matt Larson may have info); #2874=engine only [George E. Klein, circa 1970]; #2880 = 4175, RHD, body #90 [Elliott Klein - any relation to George?]; |
Dec.30 | 38 | 2883 | 2846 | 2887 | #2856 = 4375S [exported to Antwerp, Belgium]; #2861 = 4375; #2865 = 4391 [exported to Havana, Cuba]; #2871 = 4260 [exported to Bombay, India (for Maharajah of Tikari???)]; #2872 = bare chassis (or 4235 conv. cpe.?); #2873 = bare chassis RHD [exported to London - via; carries convertible Victoria body by Lancefield]; #2876 = 4235 [currently (2003) in Norway]; #2877 = 4260, shipped to NY., 12/24/30, returned (unsold) to factory, shipped to Philadelphia 9/28/31; #2880 = bare chassis (or 4175 body 90), RHD - Madame X, exported to Antwerp & London); #2881 = 4175 (went to Miami); #2882 = 4375 (went to Cincinnati); #2883 = 4312 (went to Boston); #2884 = 4260 (for factory stock); #2885 = 4375 (went to Syracuse); #2886 = 4235 (for factory stock); #2887 = 4375 (last "Series 452" V-16, for 1930, went to St. Louis; shipped 12.31.30]; |
Jan.31 | 25 | 2908 | 2888 | 2908 |
#2888 = 4330 (?) (1st "Series 452A" V-16, for 1931, went to New Bedford); #2889 = 4260 (went to Chicago); #2888 = 4330 (?) (1st 1931 V-16, went to New Bedford); #2889 = 4380 or 4260? (went to Chicago, then LaRue Thomas in Los Angeles); #2890 = 4312 (went to Chicago); #2891 = ["43" group sedan?], went to Minneapolis; #2892 = 4355 (went to Chicago); #2893 = 4291 (went to Chicago); #2894 = 4330(?) (went to Chicago); #2895 = 4335(?) Conv. Cpe., Antilles+Boatswain Blue, Wiese Bedford cord, 6 Delphine blue wire wheels, cost $7925 [or $6975?], went to St. Louis; #2905 = AWP, black, Wiese color 3898 [maroon taupe], silver leaf stripe, 6 wire wheels, cost $7925 [or $7205???]; |
Feb.31 | 47 | 2955 | 2909 | 2955 | #2914 = 4375 [exported to Stockholm]; #2922 = 4375 [under restoration, 5/2004]; #2927 = 4260 [RHD, exported to Bombay, India (possibly for the Maharajah of Tikari???)]; #2946 = 4330S? |
Mar.31 | 37 | 2992 | 2956 | 2992 | #2974 was exported to London; #2981 = 4330S [shipped to St. Louis, MI] (Matt Larson says 2966) = exported to Antwerp on 17.12.1930 for American millionaire Jay Gould]; #2987 = 4260 ??? [now engine only, put into '34 Ford ?]; |
Apr.31 | 47 | 3039 | 2993 | 3039 | #2998 (or#2797) = 4260 [unsure]; #3000 = 4291 for crown prince of Thailand; #3002 = 4330S, body #282 per R. LeForge [4361S per Fred Weber and J. Schild; T-boned by a train; #3006 = 4155 #13, currently [2001] in UK; #3010=[unknown; now (2012) chassis only]; #3026-3029 = unknown [two chassis used for display??? - #3026 is also reported on British style 4381 [reg. London, EUC 510], Motor Sport, 11/62, p. 894 [possibly owing to confusion between engine/chassis Nos.???] |
May.31 | 50 | 3089 | 3040 | 3089 | #3050 = 4175 ??? [now engine only]; #3052 = [believed to have been 4302]; #3053 = 4175 ???; #3060 = 4260 ??? [now engine parts only]; #3080 = 4130S ??? [now engine only]; |
Jun.31 | 46 | 3135 | 3090 | 3135 | #3101 = 4375 [shipped to New York]; $3106 = 4375S, body #449; #3108 = 4375, body #411 [known as "blue boy"]; #3110=4380; #3118 = 4302, body #107 [last 4302 built]; #3132 = 4276 |
Jul.31 | 17 | 3152 | 3136 | 3152 | |
Aug.31 | 7 | 3159 | 3153 | 3159 | #3154 [open number - not bodied]; |
Sep.31 | 12 | 3171 | 3160 | 3171 | #3164 = 4291, body #14 [converted to 4264B in '70s], 3165 = 4302, body #94 [Dick Gold car, has many features of 452B]; #3171 = 4375S, body #438 [only the chassis remains]; |
Oct.31 | 14 | 3185 | 3172 | 3185 | #3172=4380, body #??? [owned by C. Gillet, MD]; #3180 = 4130S ??? [car destroyed - now engine only]; #3184 = 4476, body #5 [once owned bv Neil Nicastro, now Brent Merrill] |
Nov.31 | 6 | 3191 | 3186 | 3191 | |
Dec.31 | 0 | 3191 | 0 | 0 | |
Jan.32 | 0 | 3191 | 0 | 0 | |
Feb.32 | 59 | 3250 | 3192 | 3251 | #3192 = [open number - not bodied?]; #3193 = [open number - not bodied?];#3215 = 4375S [offered on Hemmings, 12/2003]; #3220 = 4235 [info from K. Kraakmo]; #3223 = possibly 4302 in France; #3225 = 4260, body #85; #3227 = 4391 ??? [car desgtroyed - now engine only]; #3232 = [shipped 2.20.32 - last unit from factory???]; #3245 = 4380, body #363 [survivor]; #3249 = 4260, body #71 [survivor]; #3251 = 4355, to NY [lot may have included style 3289B town car (1932?)]; 3252 = [Last V16] (not 3251 ????) |
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I should like to extend special thanks here to owner-enthusiast Rick LeForge who donated his personal V-16 archives for the "Cadillac Database" in May 2009. Rick's material includes "fingerprint" cards of all the sixteens he had encountered since the fifties. There is no doubt that these cars (in some case only PARTS of these cars) survived. What Rick did, before the age of digital photography, was to apply a piece of white card to the car's body tag, then rub over it with a soft pencil (I can remember doing this as a pre-teen, with collectible coins of the world; we would exchange with other collectors these heads-and-tails "fingerprints" of our coins.
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© 1996, Yann
Saunders and the Cadillac-LaSalle Club, Inc.
[ Background image: montage from V-16 brochure, Yann Saunders' collection ]